Powerful Patriot.

[RandyG]

Well Gang,as we all know,Mr. Beer had to withdraw the Patriot Lager HME from the shelves. I had used it twice in the Powerful Patriot recipe.I really liked the brew. Luckily I found some along with the American Lite so I bought 2 of each to brew a 5 gal. batch. I went to my LHBS and asked the fellow there to whip me up a good "Germanish" blend of grains for a steep. He gave me a 1.5 lb. mixture of 3 different ones including Munich,Vienna,and CaraMunich. My problem is that it's TOO stinking hot to brew,much less ferment. My brewroom is 86 degrees and I have no way of keeping my fermenter cool. I'd use Belle Saison yeast, but I want to keep the flavors of the brew the way they come out. The grain is in a vacuumed sealed bag,and I was wondering how long it will keep that way? Will putting it in the fridge help? I probably won't be able to brew now until September. Can you give a brother some advice? TIA Randy G.

[Dawg LB Steve]

If it is vacuum sealed I don't see any reason you can't pop it into the freezer or even refrigerated till you can use it.

[Bluejaye]

Was it crushed, or unmilled? I'm pretty sure you can easily store unmilled for a year at room temperature, and crushed in the fridge/freezer for a month or two.

[DaYooper]

Worst case is you will only be out a buck or two if you decide to pitch it and replace it with fresh grains.

Then again, those Better Beer kits probably sit on the shelves for some time and their grains are crushed. Ive done a few of those while "growing up" and never had a problem.

[mashani]

I think as long as you keep it in a cool and dry place it should be fine. I've never frozen crushed grain, but I don't see why you could not do this if you wanted to. You would want to make sure it is well sealed, that is all.

[RandyG]

while I got all you UBERBREWERS here, let me ask you.Do you think using 2x Patriot Lagers and 2x American Lt. hme's would give me enough hop definitions for a 5 gallon batch ? I'm also using a 1.5 lb. grain mix for steeping. I could do a 20,10,5 hop schedule if need be. If you think I should add more hops for a 5 gallon batch,what kind would you use and how much. I have to brew this in 2x 2.5 gallon batches ,at 20 minutes each, so I could modify the hop additions if need be in each. TIA Randy G.

[BigPapaG]

while I got all you UBERBREWERS here, let me ask you.Do you think using 2x Patriot Lagers and 2x American Lt. hme's would give me enough hop definitions for a 5 gallon batch ? I'm also using a 1.5 lb. grain mix for steeping. I could do a 20,10,5 hop schedule if need be. If you think I should add more hops for a 5 gallon batch,what kind would you use and how much. I have to brew this in 2x 2.5 gallon batches ,at 20 minutes each, so I could modify the hop additions if need be in each. TIA Randy G.

Depending on how hoppy you want it, anywhere from a quarter ounce to a half ounce each if the hops have a middle of the road AA %... If you are only boiling for twenty minutes, you will get more flavor than bitterness anyway.

If you split the hops again and do a small charge at T-20 and another at T-5 or at Flameout, you can enhance both flavor and aroma.

I'm thinking Saaz would be a decent choice... Would keep it along the lines of a typical American or German Lager style beer.

Others may chime in here as well.

[mashani]

Depends on what you mean by hop definition. It will give you enough bitterness for a nice APA style of beer. But you will want to supplement it with some late hops to get more hop flavor/aroma if that's your intent.

You could do it simply as a hop stand instead of a boil, and if using just the HMEs that's probably the best way vs truly boiling the HMEs.

IE for a 5 gallon batch depending on your pot size, boil some water in it with the lid on so it generates a lot of steam and sanitizes the pot. Then dump some/all of the HMEs in it and stir it up with a sanitized spoon, and bring it back up to around 160 if it's not that warm still (depends on how much water you boiled). And then add 2-3oz of hops of your choice (cascade would be nice). And put the lid on the pot and walk away for 20, 30, or even 40 minutes and let it sit. That's what we call a hop stand, this is a simple way of doing it with HMEs - and it will develop nice flavor/aroma. If you start with your temps around 170 you will get 5-10% AAU extraction out of them too depending on volume/heat stability if you want a little bit more bitterness. Putting a lid on the pot will help keep the more volatile aroma/flavor compounds in the mix even starting at a higher temperature.

If you want even more AAUs and still get flavor/aroma, you can do as above, but once the lid is on turn the heat and bring it to where it is just barely starting to boil, then turn off the heat and walk away as above. As long as you don't take off the lid, some of the blown off volatile oils will recondense back into the wort as it cools, so you will get some more AAUs from when temp is between 170-boiling, and still get flavor/aroma out of that addition. (and yes, I have done this as an experiment with some HMEs I got on sale, and I got really nice results). EDIT: And no you will not get DMS from doing this.

EDIT: And yes RE: BigPapa's post above, don't necessarily go with American hops, I am just suggesting it if what you want is more of an APA. You could very well use german/noble hops and get nice beer too. But I've used the Patriot to make really good APAs, so I know it works well there.