Bier von Apollo (Continuous hop bursted/stand "German" IPA)

[mashani]

Family is away so I can make stinky beer

I decided to do one of my "session ipa" type of beers, but this is actually more like a real IPA, because that the Apollo hops are totally whacked at 17.8% AA... When I get hops above even 7%AA I think "hop burst". So I did that. But even that doesn't tame this beast, so I gave the beer the same treatment as one of my session IPAs to get enough maltyness in it to balance the bitter beast, but with more of a real IPA level of grain.

2.5 gallon target BIAB Mash of:

3.5# 2-row (Briess)
2.0# Munich (German)
1.0# Vienna (German)
3oz Honey Malt (this won't add significant sweetness compared to an amount of crystal then would be "normal" here - but it will amp up the Munich and Vienna profile a bit more).

2oz of Apollo split into 1/4oz piles

Starting at T-25 toss in 1/4oz at 5 minute intervals down to T-0

At T-0, rapidly cool to 170, then toss in the remaining 1/2oz of Apollo.

Put lid on, and let stand 20 minutes.

Cool, add to fermenter, pitch starter made from some of my washed Wyeast 1007 (German Ale).

Probably around 11 or 12 SRM. OG was 1.066. I used the German ale because besides Nottingham it's the only ale yeast that's really happy at my current temps, and hey, I had that German theme going.

If you want to figure the real bitterness, figure that each of the above additions counts as 5-10 minutes more AAU extraction because of the hop stand. So it's like 80-100... or something stupid like that. That's why all that malty malt is in there. To "balance" it at my relatively low OG for an IIPA level of bitterness.

I tasted the wort. It almost made my head explode LOL. It should be awesome.

There was a radical amount of lupulin colored hop oil floating on top of the wort in the fermenter when I pitched for the amount of hops I used. I don't know if my batch of hops was "special" or this is normal for it, but it was freaky.

EDIT: I might dry hop this. I dunno. I don't have any more Apollo, so the question is what? Apollo is described as "citrus, grapefruit, orange, pine, resin, and cannabis". I ate a pellet fragment, and yeah it had all that. And I'd add "Dank". It's going to be like Simcoe on crack as it is. Maybe Amarillo?

[Brewbirds]

Looks to be another great one from you Mashani.

When you do your hop burst batches you are just boiling for hot break and the short boils right? So when you say T-20 the boil is only going to be slightly longer than a total of twenty minutes?

Also wonder if you have used FWH on any of these?

[BlackDuck]

Wow. That looks really tasty. Nice recipe.

[mashani]

Looks to be another great one from you Mashani.

When you do your hop burst batches you are just boiling for hot break and the short boils right? So when you say T-20 the boil is only going to be slightly longer than a total of twenty minutes?

Also wonder if you have used FWH on any of these?

This was AG, so it had a 60 minute boil, and I just started tossing in hops at 25 minute before the end of the boil. As in 35 minutes into the boil.

If I was doing it extract then I'd just do it as you said.

I've not ever tried FWH. I guess I should one of these days in a batch like this.

[Inkleg]

****DROOL****

[mashani]

Wow. That looks really tasty. Nice recipe.

****DROOL****

I hope so. I was more or less "winging it" based on how I make "session IPAs" that are over hopped for their OG.

I forgot that 1007 is a true top cropping yeast. I shouldn't forget that. It's messy LOL.

[BigPapaG]

Amarillo would be awesome as a dry hop for it!

[mashani]

I bottled this. As an update, I did end up dry hopping 1/2oz of Amarillo. I was a bit afraid to throw any more in since I already had 2oz of commando hops in the fermenter. I should not have been - I really got no hop bits in the bottling wand. The LBC conical is really nice in this regard, all 2oz of the commando hops were down in the trub and didn't come out.

The 1007 went nuts, it spewed all over the place, first batch that really blew out of my LBC so far. Yellow sticky hop oil laden goop all over the place. There is a lot of hop oil in 2oz of Apollo it seems! Finished at 1.013. It tasted malty and dry (not sweet) and crisp with a bready biscuit like flavor, bitter but not harsh, some citrus but a lot more resin/pine/earthy flavors. More Amarillo would have brought out the citrus more, so if I do it again, I might do a full oz.

Looking forward to trying one in about 3 weeks.

[BigPapaG]

Nice! Should end up being pretty good...

The Amarillo should stick around though... It seems in my experience to have pretty good staying power.

When I use a lot of it, I get what I like to describe as a 'juicy' quality...

My latest IPL as an ounce of it in dry hop and that was the first thing that came to mind...

The second was that I really need to kick my Amarillo habit...

[mashani]

I'm drinking this... first bottle. Looks like a festbier. For a split second as you drink the impression is "yum festbier" and then *BAM* the hops smack that festbier on it's ass, and make the naked cat on the glass cry. Yeah it's bitter, but considering how low of an OG it is for the hop load it's balanced pretty well. The mouthfeel is almost "slick" because of all the hop oils. Starts with malt, then a strong resiny/less citrusy/doped up Simcoe like flavor hits you along with very firm bitterness and it's all mixed with a bit of fruit loops (I don't know what else to call it) on the nose. Finishes malty but not "sweet" IE like a festbier, with a flavor like biscuits with but with bitter orange marmalade, and some more hints of fruit loops. The malt profile is present up front, more subdued in the middle and creeps back into the picture in the finish.

It would probably be better with more of a mix of late hops, especially something like more Amarillo or Citra - but I think this base concept is solid, and I now know exactly what Apollo brings to the party.

I like it.

EDIT: Pic...

P1090479.JPG (38.02 KiB) Viewed 2176 times

[mashani]

So the mash is on for this beer again. Same exact grain bill, except I am using up the last 2oz of English Medium Crystal I have in place of the Honey Malt. And I'm using 2oz of Apollo as in the recipe, but mixed with 1oz of centennial. Starting the boil at T-20 instead of T-25, and throwing a larger bit into it as the hopstand. And using WLP029 (German Ale/Kolsch) yeast instead of the 1007, as that's what I've got.

Other then that it's the same LOL.

[Pudge]

So what are your thoughts on the 1007 for ales?

It sounds like I am in the same boat. I ferment in a chest freezer in the garage. I can hold cooler temps easily, but have no good way of warming a wort or holding a warmer temp. I like to ramp up ales towards the end of fermentation.

Wyeast 1007 seems like a good option since it'll ferment so cool. But, it ferments very clean... almost lager like, right? Should I just use a lager strain? Will 1007 add enough character to make it worth it?

At this point, I plan to just brew lagers until March or so.

[Beer-lord]

I made a faux lager with 1007 a while back at 58 and really enjoyed it. That was before I had a fermentation freezer to chill beer. I'd do it again. I couldn't tell it wasn't a real lager though I don't drink that many to be picky about.

[mashani]

@Pudge:

1007 and 2565 (Kölsch) both are great if you are 55-60. But if you want a fruity/estery ale, you aren't going to get it at those temps, it will be crisp and lager like. So that is why I put Munich and Vienna into this. It gives it a lot of character and balances the bitter, but doesn't make it "sweet" or "caramel" like as would a bunch of crystal. It's most certainly different then 2-row IPA with Ale yeast, but still it turned out quite good when I made it last. So I'm assuming my new version will be too.

You could also use Nottingham as long as your at least 56-57 degrees.

If you want fruity, you could use S-23 lager yeast. It's more ale like then lager like for a lager yeast - and most certainly more ale like then 1007/2565 at those same temps. If you ferment with it 56-60 the fruitiness it adds can be pleasant, if perhaps unwanted if your trying to make say a Bohemian Pilsner. If you ferment much COOLER then that then it gets really weird and even more strongly fruity. Folks who try to ferment with it at 50 hate on it. I know that sounds wrong for a lager yeast, but it's a weird one.

The WLP029 I'm using here in my new batch actually likes it better around 64 degrees. But I have unusual warm temperatures right now, so I'm ok with that.

I might have mentioned this in the OP, but in case I didn't - anyone who is considering this recipe. Try a bottle of Victory Hop Devil first. This is by no means a clone of that beer, nor is it intended to be... But if you hate that beer because of how malty it is, then this won't be your cup of tea. I happen to love that beer though.

[Pudge]

Thanks.

Totally agree on the Munich. I get a pronounced sweetness.
Totally agree on the S-23. I avoid that strain completely. Too damn goofy to work with.